There has been much discussion and disagreement among the body of Christ as to when the church will leave this earth. When is rapture? What does scripture say?
It's an awesome thought to think that before the antichrist is revealed the church will be raptured out and won't have to endure any of tribulation. I would love for that to be true if that is God's will. Who wouldn't? The question at hand is what does scripture support? This is what we discuss today. Also before we get started let me ask this. Did you know you get a blessing just for reading the book of Revelation all the way through yourself( instead of relying on your church or someone else to tell you what it says)? Revelation 1:3
First, at this moment let me ask everyone to clear your minds. It doesn't matter if you support pre-tribulation rapture, mid-tribulation rapture, a rapture after the great tribulation, or no rapture at all. I ask you before you read any further to go now in prayer to our Lord and ask Him to guide you through this by the Holy Spirit. Ask Him to remove all of your own knowledge and everything you think you know. This doesn't mean you are wrong. This means when we finish reading we want to not have our own prideful conclusion but an answer guided by God's word and Spirit. So please pray for discernment, an open mind, and guidance of His love and truth.
The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that hearkeneth unto counsel is wise. Proverbs 12:15
Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 1 Corinthians 3:18
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge; because you have rejected knowledge, I reject you from being a priest to me. And since you have forgotten the law of your God, I will also forget your children. Hosea 4:6
This is where we don't want to be.
The next thing we need to address is why is it important if we know when rapture is? The bible says we will not know the hour and the day. That is absolutely correct and not what we are going for here. Also, let me add if someone puts a date on it, the devil is deceiving them and you should tell them so and pray for them. Matthew 24 does however reference that we should know the season. We should know it's at the door, to use the reference in the bible. Why do we need to know this?
- If it is a pre-tribulation rapture, as some say with a second chance at salvation then we would want to prepare messages for those left behind as you see some questions posed to this on social media.
- If it is a mid-tribulation rapture, then we would need to know what to be prepared for and what steps as Christians we need to take so that our faith and knowledge of the word is enough to sustain us through hard times as well as know what our job as the church is in these times. We must know what to expect so we are not deceived by demons and/or false doctrine ( 1 Timothy 4:1) in the church buildings so as not to get caught in the falling away (2 Thessalonians 2:3) or be found lukewarm and be spit out of the body of Christ (Revelation 3:15-16).
- If it is after the great tribulation we must prepare for everything above as well as seeing God's wrath carried out on everyone around us that is not a spirit filled Christian. This might include being strong enough to witness this with people you love. It would require us to have such a relationship with the Lord that you can hear His every command and obey without question or hesitation regardless of what you believe the results will be. Which really we should be doing anyway but that is another sermon all together.
- If there is no rapture, then we would need to deal with the fact that in the old earth passing away we would too, and this is after all of the above. Then we would rise as the dead.
So there is a different result and higher need of preparation of faith, strength, knowledge of the word to sustain you, and most of all your relationship with Jesus. Again each of us should strive to attain that highest form of a relationship with him regardless, but why mentally prepare yourself to watch someone you love die unnecessarily. In the same spirit why believe you don't need to if in fact you will witness it.
Right now some of you are saying things to the effect of, "Doesn't matter I won't be here, pre-trib", or " this is pointless there is no rapture", etc STOP IT. YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BE CLEARING YOUR MIND OF YOUR OWN KNOWLEDGE! WE HAVEN'T EVEN STARTED SCRIPTURE YET.
Since it would be the first scenario, we will first examine scripture used to support a pre-tribulation rapture. I will note everyone that I was taught in church and some that people have given me. We will go through them in context and without changing any words or meanings to fit an idea but instead rightly divide the word of God. We will comment in between each as to the meaning of each scripture, not what we are taught it means if you read it in a certain way. There will be no certain order, such as chronological or order of prophecy etc, to the scriptures. We will not attempt to put them in order as we see them in the bible, but just as they are written in my notes.
For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17
Here we have what many Christians believe to be evidence of the rapture being pre-tribulation. Many say this verse is proof that rapture and second coming are two separate events, that this verse is proof rapture is supposed to be secret, and that the second coming would be Revelation 14:14-16 and Matthew 24:29-30. The reason used is because in this verse Jesus doesn't come all the way to earth but instead call us upward to the clouds, but if you read Revelation 14:14-16 then you notice Jesus stays on His cloud in those verses as well.
Now let us look at the meaning of these verses. It says those that are alive do not prevent those that are asleep, but that an angel will appear and sound a trumpet. Then the dead in Christ shall rise first, followed by those that are alive and all together rise to Jesus in the clouds to be with Him forever. We look for all investigative elements here:
- Who- the dead in Christ and those that are still alive that remain
- When- until the coming of the Lord
- What- a gathering in the clouds announced by an angel and a trumpet
- Where- from earth to the clouds.
The when in these verses say until the coming of the Lord. They do not say until the start of tribulation. There is no mention in these verses stating there are two separate events being the rapture and the second coming. As a matter of fact, it clearly says the rapture(caught up together- rapture being the latin word from original translation) happens to those that remain alive unto the coming of the Lord.
We also see no evidence of this being a secret event. It comes with an appearance of an archangel and a sound of a trumpet in the clouds. This doesn't sound secretive or hidden. There are no words in the verses themselves to suggest a secret.
Another verse used to speak of rapture and the second coming being separate events is Matthew 24:29-30. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
In these verses, those that support pre-tribulation rapture would say this is the second coming. This verse definitely doesn't say the same thing as 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17. After the tribulation of those days the sun and moon go dark and stars fall from the sky and the powers of the heavens are shaken. Then the sign of the Son of man or Jesus appears in the sky and everyone mourns and sees Him.
- When- immediately after tribulation of those days
- Where seeing from earth up to the clouds.
- Who- Jesus in heavens and tribes on earth
- What- second coming of Jesus
This clearly describes what will happen right before Jesus appears in the clouds but does not say it is a different event. Actually it would seem that this infers 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17 happens immediately after these verses.
For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. 1Thessalonians 5:9 For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God; And wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come. 1Thessalonians 1:9-10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I will also keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Revelation 3:10
God has not appointed us to wrath. Thank goodness because who can handle God's wrath. It does not however say God has not appointed us to tribulation. As a matter of fact the bible speaks of two different kinds of wrath. First being the seven bowls or vials of wrath at the end of the great tribulation. The other being the wrath of the lake of fire or hell. God's children or those that are born again are most certainly not appointed to the wrath of hell. That's what the salvation of Jesus is about. So that leaves that we are not appointed to the seven bowls/vials of wrath in Revelation chapters 15 and 16. I do not know of a scripture that defines tribulation as God's wrath but if you do please email it to me at the address on the home page. The great tribulation and persecution of the saints is actually the wrath of the antichrist, not God. It's when the devil himself walks the earth. Neither of these verses say we will be caught up before the tribulation. Also Psalm 91 clearly states that while we are here on earth during these times God is our secret hiding place and we are protected under His wing from everything He "dishes out" on earth during tribulation. We will not experience what the sinners do during tribulation because we obtained salvation by the blood of the Lamb Jesus Christ which is the same prophetic repeat of the lambs blood on the door posts in Egypt. The blood of Jesus covering over us shows the destruction to Passover us just like in Egypt in the days of Moses. This is also why we see the plagues of Egypt be falling the earth now but that is another post all together.
The verse from Revelation says because we have kept the word we will be kept from the hour of temptation. That doesn't say tribulation. It says temptation. If we keep putting the word tribulation in the place of all these words, then we are getting into replacement theology. That is not good. You don't replace what God said with your own meanings. He frowns on that. As a matter of fact as far as the book of Revelation is concerned, there is a dire punishment for it. You will lose your salvation. Revelation 22:18-19 states if you add to the words of this book the plagues written in this book will be added to you and if you take words away from this prophecy then God will take away your part out of the book of life. Please read the full verses for confirmation.
Those that support a pre-tribulation rapture would also use certain verses to say that the bible demands the separation of the church and Israel, and that Israel must be purified after the end of the church age. Also that the two witnesses testimony shall establish a thing which separates believers from non believers before tribulation. These verses are offered as scriptural support.
These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful. Revelation 17:4
Amen. Jesus wins because He is Lord and King. Those that are saved and with Him are called and chosen and faithful. No mention of the split of church and Israel here, or the end of the church age, or even rapture for that matter.
One witness shall not rise up against a man for iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established. Deuteronomy 19:15
First off, if you read this in context and not just this verse, you see this passage discusses how the Israelites are to deal with one another's sin in everyday life. It speaks nothing of end times, much less rapture. It certainly doesn't speak of the two witnesses in Revelation. It says, starting in the verse before it, you can't move a neighbors landmark that marks where their land is( don't change the survey lines- this is mine; that is yours.) If you charge someone with this crime or any other sin at all, you will need at least two or three witnesses to back you up. In today's terms, they don't want to hear any he said she said bologna. This shouldn't even be included in any scriptural support of the day of the Lord or rapture in any way.
Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in the dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead. Come my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain. Isaiah 26:19-21
This is a prophecy from Isaiah. It says our dead shall rise out of the grave. the earth will give up the dead buried in it. The next verse is what pre-trib rapture supporters would say is proof Isaiah called for a separation of believers and non believers before tribulation by saying that the believers will be raptured. All mentions of rapture speak of being caught up or brought up in the clouds. This however does not say that, nor does it speak of the believers leaving the earth at all in any form. It says my people go into your rooms and shut the doors behind you and hide until his wrath is passed by. Why would you be raptured up during wrath and then returned after a little while? It says hide in your house while the blood of the slain are avenged. So during tribulation we are supposed to stay in our house and not come out just like Passover in Egypt again. This is another verse that supports God will protect us here on this earth from tribulation and any punishment He puts out there. Again you must be covered in the blood of the Lamb to be under this protection. This IS Egypt all over again, but way worse on those outside His covering. Moving on...
Seventy Weeks are determined upon thy people and upon the holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. Daniel 9:24
I could spend hours on the prophecy in this one verse by referencing Jewish history and cross referencing other verses, but that is for another post as well. The main point of this verse right now is that though this discuss when the day of the Lord is coming, as to the season- not the day or hour, this does not say that Israel should be separated from the church or body of Christ. Even if you cross reference all back through the book of Daniel and the vision given to him, there is no mention of separating Israel from the body of Christ. In fact Romans chapter 11 tell us the body of Christ is grafted into the vine that is Israel and we are one. The gentiles that accept Jesus as their Savior become part of the people of Israel. We are not part of the tribes, but we are now Israel.
The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord saying, Thus speaketh the Lord God of Israel, saying, Write thee all the words that I have spoken unto thee in a book. For, lo, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the Lord: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it. And these are the words that the Lord spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the Lord; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness? Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it. For it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him: But they shall serve the Lord their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them. Therefore fear not, O my servant Jacob, saith the Lord; neither be dismayed, O Israel: for, lo, I will save thee from afar, and thy seed from the land of their captivity; and Jacob shall return, and shall be in rest, and be quiet, and none shall make him afraid. For I am with thee, saith the Lord, to save thee: though I make a full end of nations wither I have scattered thee, yet will I not make a full end of thee: but I will correct thee in measure, and will not leave thee altogether unpunished. Jeremiah 30:1-11
God told Jeremiah to write this down and put it in a book. He said that He will bring His people out of captivity again and give them back their lands in Israel. Then He speaks of the time of Jacob's trouble when every man will suffer like a woman in labor and none will be like it, but He will save Jacob and his children, which is the descendants of Israel, before the Jewish people are no more. This speaks of the return of the Jewish people to Israel in 1948. This prophecy has already been mostly fulfilled. It says that not all will make it, but some will be saved. Some will perish. Israel was re-established in 1948 after the death of entirely too many Jews, descendants of Jacob, in the Holocaust. With the establishment of Israel. The Jewish people now had a home where they could defend their safety. There will still be a punishment during tribulation for Israel according to Revelation. There will be an earthquake that kills 7000 people as well as wars until the day of the Lord.
I do not see any reference however to tribulation being a purifying purpose for only Israel. I do not see any mention of the church being separated from Israel. If you consider that many times in the bible after the death of David, that Jesus is referred to as David the King or the root of David, then you see a contrary point here actually. It says that Israel will worship God and David their king. They would not have worshipped the actual king David only obeyed him, so obviously this is a reference to worshipping God and Jesus. Since Romans says we are grafted into Israel, we can safely say before the day of the Lord all of Israel, gentiles and Jews will worship Jesus. We already see that with an explosion of Messianic Jews. Messianic Jews are those that have accepted Jesus Christ as their Savior.
For then shall be a great tribulation, such as was not seen since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor shall ever be. And except those days shall be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened. Matthew 24:21-22
These verses are the words of Jesus himself. This doesn't just speak of tribulation but specifically of the great tribulation. It will be so bad, that if God didn't shorten the days there would be no flesh left. So for that reason it will be shortened. Nor for those that speak of a pre-trib rapture, the word shortened is used to prove that it is before tribulation. Again there we are stepping into replacement theology which is simply a deception. You can't change the bible. It also says no flesh would be saved. This means if there were a rapture before tribulation then there would still be no flesh saved because they were removed from the earth. What it does prove is that our flesh will be here during tribulation and we will need the intervention of Jesus to save us so that we do not perish as well.
Lastly, pre-tribulation supporters would use the verses in Acts 15:13-18. I am sure each of you are aware that we must not choose parts of the bible to adhere to and leave other parts out. Therefore we cannot pick a few verses and claim them to mean one thing when read with the whole chapter in context actually mean something completely different. That would be like reading something that says " My dog Spot is black. He has 3 white spots and 3 brown spots the size of tomatoes. " and saying it means Spot is a completely black dog with no other colors.
And after they had held their peace, James answered, saying, Men and brethren, hearken unto me: Simeon hath declared how God at first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for His name. And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things. Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world. Acts 15:13-18
This would be very convincing, if not for reading the whole chapter in it's context. This chapter discusses how Paul, Barnabas, and James were teaching the church that Gentiles do not need to be circumcised to be saved. If they were not already they do not have to now be circumcised like a Jew to receive the grace of Jesus Christ because Jesus died for all Jews and Gentiles alike." Take out of them a people " in this passage means that just like in Revelation 18:4 the Gentiles come out of the non believers into the blood of Jesus Christ and salvation. Then, after the time allotted for Gentiles and Jews alike to have the chance to be born again, a temple will be rebuilt on the ruins of the old temple. What this passage holds for us as far as prophecy for the end of days is that the temple will be rebuilt on the same site it was torn down and not somewhere else. This will happen so that people can see that bible prophecy has come true just as God promised and they might come to the Lord knowing the bible is not a lie.
After this I looked, and behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. Revelation 4:1
Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 1 Corinthians 15:51-52
We are going to start by breaking this down immediately because this obviously describes the moment of rapture.
- Who- We( those alive or the ones that shall not sleep) and the dead
- What- changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye
- Where- earth because that is where the dead are
- When-at the last trumpet,( there are 7 seals then 7 trumpets) when it sounds
This verse is the most revealing I have found. It tells you exactly when rapture will happen. At the sound of the last trumpet, rapture will occur right before the bowls/vials of wrath start. In one verse we have undeniable proof in laymen's terms of the exact moment of rapture. You then proceed to Revelation and see what must happen before the last trumpet, so you know what happens before rapture can happen.
Our next point of discussion would be a mid-tribulation rapture. There are some Christians that support a rapture after tribulation but before the great tribulation. This is called a mid-tribulation rapture. This view would support that we would not be here to make the choice of the mark of the beast. Let's look at some scripture.
Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice and be exceedingly glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you. Matthew 5:11-12
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. Matthew 10:34-35
These verses are used by mid-tribulation supporters to say we will be here for tribulation. They say it shows proof of persecution during tribulation, and that Jesus has no intention of things being peaceful. That is exactly correct. The first verse alone could mean persecution at any time throughout history but when the book of Matthew is taken in context with other chapters and verses we see that this is meant for the persecution during tribulation during the 5th seal. The mid-tribulation aspect however does not take into account that this also concerns this persecution of the saints and choice of the mark of the beast in the great tribulation. The way we the saints are withheld from wrath is the sword of Jesus fights for us and Psalm 91, Isaiah 54 and other verses tell us we have the covering of the blood of the Lamb and no weapon formed against us shall prosper, no harm will come to us over any tribulation He brings for He sends His angels to protect us. This is how we escape these trials. Just like in Egypt when they marked the door posts with lamb's blood we mark ours with the blood of the Lamb by accepting Jesus and surrendering our lives fully to Him.
And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming and of the end of the world? And Jesus answered them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying I am Christ: and shall deceive many. And ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilence, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows. Then they shall deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many of you be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. But he that endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then the end shall come. When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel, the prophet, stand in the holy place, ( whoso readeth, let him understand:) Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains: Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. And woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the Sabbath day: For then shall be a great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. Behold I have told you before. Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. For as the lightening cometh out from the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together. Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from the heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribe of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Matthew 24:1-31
Those that support a mid-tribulation but pre-great tribulation use this passage to prove we will be here for tribulation even though we are exempt from the wrath of God and that there is no pre-tribulation rapture. Now along with this scripture Mark 13:1-27 and Luke 21:1-28 are cited as well. Since these passages are three different accounts of the same speech from Jesus as He was talking to all the apostles at that moment, we can take this one commentary and apply it to those as well, though there are some minor differences as there is more detail in some of the other books. For example Mark tells you where you might be delivered to for persecution and not to preplan what you say but to let the Holy Spirit speak instead. He also gives more detail as to whom will betray whom. Luke says great earthquakes and adds fearful sights in the sign of tribulation as well as whom will betray whom. Luke also says, and this is important, that even though you will be here, not to worry about tribulation because not a hair on your head will be harmed. Luke adds that with the abomination of desolation Israel will also be encompassed with armies, and people will fall by the sword and be taken captive, and adds the sea and waves roaring, men's hearts failing them for fear, and distress of nations to the signs in the heavens to the signs right before the return of Jesus.
We start with Jesus speaking to His disciples telling them the temple will be destroyed and what the signs of the end will be.
- false Christs
- wars and rumors of wars, nation against nation, kingdom against kingdom
- famines, pestilence, earthquakes in divers places
- saints delivered up and hated, killed, offended, betraying one another, hating one another in persecution
- false prophets deceiving many
- love of many wax cold or fall away
- gospel preached to all nations
- abomination of desolation standing in the holy place
Then it says those in Judea should flee to the mountains. Don't take time to gather your belongings but drop what you're doing and run. It also says woe to those with child and nursing. Let's stop for a second. First of all, mid-trib pre-great trib supporters would say we will not be here for the great tribulation. Then may I ask why they would include verses that speak of times during great tribulation. The abomination of desolation is during the great tribulation. Also in verse 21 it clearly states that this part of the passage is great tribulation. It doesn't say tribulation but great tribulation. God knew this conversation would be taking place among all of us in the end and told us not to be deceived; that's why this is clearly labeled here. Don't believe it then look at the next verses. We are going to skip 22 we discussed that earlier. Verses 23-26 carefully warn you not to be deceived and especially by false Christs or prophets, no matter what tricks they have. It says no matter what they show or tell you I told you the truth right here. Behold I have told you before. He said it beforehand, don't get fooled. Also let me ask you something else. If this clearly states we are now into verses that discuss the great tribulation in which a mid trib supporter would say we are already raptured, and all children go in the rapture, then why is it woe to those who are nursing? Shouldn't the children be gone since the words of Jesus himself, in red, just said that he was speaking of the great tribulation. If innocent children go in the rapture and the great tribulation already started but this is supposed to support a pre-great trib rapture then what are children still doing here? I digress.
As it continues it says Jesus' return will happen as quick as lightning goes from east to west. We confirmed that Jesus moved from speaking of tribulation into speaking of great tribulation. The passage continues to say immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun, and moon go dark. Now many line this up with the 6th seal, but the 6th seal says the moon turns to blood. This says the moon goes dark not to blood, so these should be in all actuality two separate events. There isn't any scripture that says the sun will only go dark once or that there will only be one sign in the sun and moon and stars. Many scripture call for signs- plural form- in the heavens. It also says stars fall from the sky and the powers of heaven will be shaken and then the sign of the Son of man appears in the sky. Then Jesus will return after the angels sound a great trumpet and gather His elect.
This passage does, as the mid-tribulation pre-great tribulation supporters say, prove we will be here for tribulation. It also proves that we will be here for the great tribulation.
This would moves us on to a mid-tribulation rapture or as some would call it, post-tribulation pre-wrath rapture, depending on whether you have studied the scripture for a difference in the great tribulation and the wrath of God. In all actuality it is a true post-tribulation rapture stance, but it is not what a post-tribulation rapture supporter would call post- tribulation rapture. So first let's discuss the difference in wrath and the great tribulation.
According to nobts.edu (for reference click here and scroll to Why Not Post-Tribulationalism?)
there are two different words for wrath in the Greek form in which the New Testament was originally written. One is essentially translated to 'outburst of anger or wrath' and the other is 'settled wrath' both of which in an English translation just say wrath. Now the outburst of anger is used 9 times in Revelation and settled wrath used 27 times throughout the New Testament all of which never subjects a believer to the wrath, such as Romans 1:18 and John 3:36. The word tribulation is used 55 times and 47 of those experiences are endured by believers. This would definitely show a difference in the biblical definitions of wrath and tribulation. Tribulation and the great tribulation according to scripture are not the same thing. They are two separate events. With that said we are first going to address post-wrath post tribulation rapture because it will be short and sweet.
There is almost nothing I can find in the way of verses anyone would use nor has anyone that supports this doctrine ever given me an actual verse other than Matthew chapter 24 which we have already covered. The few verses I have found online are: Revelation 20:4-6 which speaks of the beginning of the millennial kingdom in where those that were persecuted and beheaded for the name of Christ are to reign with Christ for 1000 years before satan is loosed again; Matthew 24:31 again we have already covered this and it does not say we will be here for wrath as well as great tribulation which we have already shown a distinction for the difference of; and these verses in John which haven't been covered so let's lay them out.
And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. John 6:39-40
No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. John 6:44
Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up on the last day. John 6:54
All of these verses are addressed because they say that we will be raised up on the last day. The question is last day of what. It doesn't say last day after God's wrath. It says last day. When you look at scripture we see the end of the great tribulation followed by God's wrath. God's wrath is obviously as instant as rapture. It required the swinging of a different sickle and all of a sudden blood is as high as a horse's neck. Just because scripture says it is on the last day, doesn't mean we will be on earth to witness the wrath. Though all these vials are poured out, they seem to hit earth all at once basically. In a matter of moments Revelation chapters 15-20 happen and all of what is left of earth, antichrist army, and the whore of Babylon fall and satan is chained and thrown in the abyss. Can I just stop for a minute and say PRAISE GOD! GLORY TO THE ALPHA AND THE OMEGA, TO OUR ABBA FATHER AND HALLELUJAH!!
So now we are left with one option to discuss. Depending on who you are, it would be mid-tribulation pre-wrath, post-tribulation pre-wrath, but according to scripture it is a post-tribulation rapture. It is in all actuality a post tribulation rapture because the great tribulation and the wrath of God are in fact two different things according to scripture.
At this point, I am going to leave my objective point of view and be very clear of what I have obtained through the Holy Spirit out of scripture. As a watchman I am called to sound a warning. I must tell you this next discussion is fully supported by scripture and this just became a persuasive narrative. You of course must seek the Holy Spirit yourself, but I know you will find through a combination of the Holy Spirit and the bible, which is how you attain truth- combination of God's word and Spirit, that truth lies here and we must be prepared in every way. Let's walk it through.
We will actually walk the whole book of Revelation through chapter 14, but I am not going to type every verse in it. If you would like to grab your bible and follow along you can see the context in between. If not you will see the point by what we put on here.
First, here are a few other points. The church and Israel are not separate and everything will happen for them together. We are one people, together, the children of God.
That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. John 17:21
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart,in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God. Romans 2:28-29
Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, in Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not he children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. Romans 9:6-8
And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakes, of the root and fatness of the olive tree; Romans 11:17
For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree? For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness if the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: Romans 11:24-26
Israel, according to the bible, is all of the Gentiles and all of the Jews that have accepted Jesus into their heart. That is what the bible considers the children of God. Everyone else is considered the children of the devil, baal, etc. Israel and the church are one and will always remain so. So, there cannot be a tribulation for Israel and not for the church. There is a tribulation for all of God's children.
These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world. John 16:33
Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened to you: But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy. If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit and the glory of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified. But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. Yet if any man suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf. For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and sinner appear? Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator. 1 Peter 4:12-19
We will be here for tribulation. The rapture does not come before tribulation. It doesn't come before the great tribulation, after the last trumpet as we pointed out already in 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 and Matthew 24:29-30. As a matter of fact, even the resurrection comes before rapture.
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
We will be here to see the antichrist and all his evil deeds. There are things that must happen before rapture can occur. The bible doesn't lie, and you can't go with that replacement theology bologna trying to make it say what you want it to because you are afraid. What are you afraid of? You died already. The day you gave your life to Christ, you died and it is Christ that lives in you. Your already dead. Fear nothing nut the Lord. The antichrist is already defeated. Read the back of the book. The saints will see the antichrist. Let no man deceive you!
Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering unto him, That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God. Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? And now ye know what with-holdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-7
Please listen brother! On the coming of Jesus and gathering to him don't let your mind be shaken, troubled, by any spirit, word, scripture about the day of Christ being at hand. In other words you don't have anything to worry about. It says DO NOT BE DECEIVED because it can't happen until the falling away happens first and the revealing of the antichrist and the abomination that causes desolation- where he stands in the temple claiming to be God- which is also the start of the great tribulation. So there goes a pre-great tribulation and a pre-tribulation rapture out the window in one verse. What's left post-tribulation/pre-wrath rapture. Anything else completely goes against scripture. Paul said, remember I told you when I was there. It's already at work. Who is the only thing in all of creation that can hold back or let the antichrist come? The answer is God. So when we kick God out of our countries, our churches( by teaching false doctrine), our homes(by not living like He told us and following the lusts of the flesh), and our lives, then He is no longer there and will not prevent the antichrist from coming.
And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all his power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:8-12
Did you read that? More importantly, did you read that by the Holy Spirit? When the antichrist is revealed, everyone that didn't already receive the love of the truth will be deceived and not be saved. God will make them believe the lie so that all who did not believe the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness will be damned. Those are strong words. No one else can come to salvation after the revealing of the antichrist. Still confused?... Try this one.
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Revelation 13:8
If you were found lukewarm, then you were spued out of the body of Christ and no longer in the book of life. We will get into that walking through Revelation. Know this, if you are not truly saved- not a fake Christian, but walking the walk saved- then when the antichrist is revealed you WILL worship him and take the mark of the beast, and don't say you won't because God said he is going to make you. God can do whatever He wants. There are only two entities in this world that truly know the status of your salvation, Jesus and you. If you aren't walking the walk then Jesus isn't in your heart. You may believe in Him but you don't know or truly love Him or truly love him if you are walking constantly in the lust of the flesh. Now I don't mean an occasional slip up. Salvation isn't a free ticket to sin, but I digress again. Back to the subject at hand. Here we go the book of Revelation, play by play. By the way did you know you get a blessing just for reading the book of Revelations yourself? Revelation 1:3
The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Revelation 1:1
This is a vision given to John.
Behold, he cometh with the clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen Revelation 1:7
Future tense, means He will come in the clouds it is not happening this second in the vision. How will even those that pierced him see it if they died 2000 years ago? It is because the resurrection happens first, before the rapture. There are several thing that Jesus tells the churches to repent of in the letters to the churches, but the most important verses in those letters lie in 3:15-16. First we will look at one other verse.
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I will keep the from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Revelation 3:10
This means that even while you are on earth during this I will not let you be tempted to deny me when the mark of the beast comes. I will give you the strength to resist temptation. It says nothing of keeping us from tribulation.
I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. Revelation 3:15-16
Before you were in the body of Christ, but if you are found lukewarm He will vomit you out. What is lukewarm? You can go to church every week and still be lukewarm. You might be lukewarm if:
- You hate anyone - because if you are in Christ you love your brother, only God knows people's hearts since you don't you love them no matter what, love the person, hate the sin;
- are at the club on the weekends partying, drinking, etc., or even at home doing the same and getting drunk and/or doing drugs including prescriptions that are not absolutely needed
- involved in sexual immorality-having sex outside of marriage, including adultery, fornication, multiple partners at the same or different times, homosexuality, and all of this includes it being done in the heart without action like fantasizing, watching pornography, making pornography, working at an exotic club or visiting one, supporting anyone that does any of these things-ex. support gay marriage
- not reading your bible and having a prayer life so as to develop your relationship with God- if you only pray when you're in trouble, you're in trouble
- God isn't first in your life above everything else- no exceptions
- obsessed with yourself- 500 selfies a month, constantly be proud of yourself- excessive pride is a sin- to God be the glory,
- dressing inappropriately- guys dressing like girls, girls trying to look like guys( this doesn't mean you can't wear pants), girls with breasts hanging out almost or skirts/shorts really short, it's not if you got it flaunt it, that's for your spouse to see guys or girls, cover it up and not so tight on the pants- all of that invites fornication, adultery, vanity and pride.
- more concerned with spending every waking moment on a video game, phone, computer doing pointless thing instead of studying the bible you say you don't have time to read.
There's a lot more, but you get the picture.
And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering and to conquer. Revelation 6:2
The antichrist is upon the earth. It doesn't say for sure whether or not he is revealed to us yet. Since John was still speaking to the churches in chapter 3 and in 5:8 the beasts and elders had vials of saints prayers we know at this point we are still on earth. In 6:4 you see peace taken from the earth with the red horseman and 2nd seal broken. The 3rd seal is broken and we see the black horse which is economic despair and famine. We come to the 4th seal, the pale horse, death with the power to kill 1/4 of the earth by the sword, with hunger, death and by the beasts of the earth. Then there is the 5th seal.
And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: And how they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And white robes were given unto everyone of them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled. Revelation 6:9-11
So if there are still saints that haven't yet been killed, then we are still on earth. The rapture hasn't happened yet. This even says those saints are still resting. They're not in heaven; they are still in the ground. Then comes the 6th seal. we keep reading through chapter 7.
Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. Revelation 7:3
We are obviously still here.
And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neitherany green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. Revelation 9:4
Guess what, still here. If those locusts are upon earth and told not to touch the saints that have the seal of God, then we haven't gone anywhere yet.
All the trumpets continue to sound as we get to chapter 10 and we now have 6 trumpets that have sounded. Guess what we are still there. Then there is what the 7 thunders uttered that is sealed up and told to John not to reveal. Then chapter 11 comes. The temple is rebuilt and the outer court left to the Gentiles. This tells us Jerusalem is divided, which is followed by the appearance of the two witnesses, their death and raising to heaven. This is followed by a great earthquake in Jerusalem killing 7000 people. Let's skip to chapter 13. The beast system rises. The one world government, and with it the antichrist.
And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. Revelation 13:7
Now we know from the moment of the abomination that causes desolation in verse 5 is when no one else can be saved, so the saints in verse 7 are us. We are still here and it's about to get even uglier. The false prophet is revealed and makes an image of the beast and everyone not saved worships that. Then everyone must choose; take the mark of the beast or be beheaded. Those that are saved, the saints are going to be given strength and not tempted. We will choose beheading to the glory of God and our great reward. The 7th trumpet sounded just before the mark. Two of the three sevens are complete, and those that escaped the mark so far are still here. We see in 14:12-13 the patience of the saints and it said blessed are those that die in the Lord from now on. So since we know no others can be saved after the abomination that causes desolation, then we know we are still here.
And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his own head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time has come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. Revelation 14:14-16
Praise GOD and HALLELUJAH! Finally the rapture... No more sorrow or pain, because it is done. All Christians agree the sowing of a seed is planting God's word for it to grow and result in that soul being saved. When that soul is saved it is ripe for harvest. This is the harvest. This is the rapture. There is no more mention of the saints on earth after this until the just before the new heaven and earth come down, and they come to earth with Jesus from heaven. The rapture and resurrection happen on the last day of the great tribulation followed by a very quick issuance of God's wrath. How do we know that? Well besides the verses from John already covered, there is this:
Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall utterly be burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her. Revelation 18:8
This speaks of the judgment of the whore Babylon, which is all that remained on earth since the antichrist leads the new Babylon and it's armies and all but the saints worshipped and followed him.
As you can see, there is no other option but a resurrection and then rapture after tribulation but before the wrath of God. Scripture just doesn't support it. If you are deceived you could fall away. Your faith and spirit won't be prepared because you will still be in shock, sitting there saying I thought I would be gone.
PLEASE DO NOT BE DECEIVED! read for yourself. Do not trust what your pastor tells you just because they are your pastor. No one will stand with you at judgment day. No one is going to stand up and say it's my fault, I told her wrong. You can't punish him, God he didn't know. THAT"S WHY HE GAVE YOU A BIBLE! READ IT YOURSELF WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT! Know the truth. May God keep you and I hope everyone kept reading to this point.
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